Talking to the Spirits, 12-13


Neo-Paganism and Its Attitudes


p. 157 books on the modern-day revival of antient Thessalian lunar Goeteia

"Decent histories of the early years of Neo-Paganism can be found in

Margot Adler's Drawing Down the Moon and

Ronald Hutton's The Triumph of the Moon."

p. 157 primitivity of Neo-Paganism & of Christianity

"when explaining ... to outsiders, we might sometimes use the analogy

"Wicca is to Neo-Paganism

{Neo-Paganism hath been current in western European since the Renaissance, in the sequence of Hermetism, Rosicrucianism, Freemasonry; and in the <arabi world (over the same time-frame) in aequivalent guises.}

as Catholicism is to Christianity"".

{Roman Catholicism is less, however, alike to primitive Christianity than are Eastern Orthodoxy and the Assyrian Church of the East. Catholicism's caelibacy for priests, for example, was not part of primitive Christianity.}

p. 164 archetypism

"One of the more surprising ... trends that has arisen ... is ... folk who ardently take part in Pagan ritual and community, yet consider {feign to consider?} themselves atheists.

{They may simply be too either to cowardly to denounce atheistic capitalist materialism; or else intent on subverting it by covert methods; or even a combination of both.}

For them, ritually calling on Gods is a way of communing with transpersonal archetypes ... . Referred to as "archetypists," theirs is a new phenomenon".

{This is by no means a "new" phainomenon, but rather an inheritance from philosophies of antiquity. In Neo-Platonic philosophy (of Noumenios, Iamblikhos, etc.), Cosmic Mind, Cosmic Soul, and Cosmic Intellect are worshipped (as likewise in the Yarsani continuation of this philosophy). There are also antient aequivalents in Bharata and in Han.}

{The authors would appear to be woefully ignorant of the history of philosophy, and likewise of the history of religions.}

pp. 172-4 Kemetism

p. 172

[quoted from Meirya, U.S. Kemetic] "One key concept of Kemetic Orthodoxy i s polyvalent {multivalent} logic, in which multiple things that seem to contradict {mutually} can be simultaneously true. For instance, there are many different creation stories."

{In resolutions to the variant mythologies (including cosmogonies) in the Puran.a-s, ascriptions to different kalpa-s are primary; also relegations are made to the several Manu-antara-s and Maha-yuga-s. (A more metaphysical resolution to these variants would be to assign them to various planes-of-existence and to sub-planes.)}

p. 173

[quoted from Queen Mother Imakhu, U.S. Kemetic Priestess] "Modern-day Kemau {KMI,w (literally, 'Blacks')}, or Kemites, ... rely heavily upon the use of oracles through cards, shells, pendulums {pendula}, and the like. ... Ultimately, the goal is to become living oracles, so that we no longer rely on tools. ...

p. 174

As Kemau, we govern ourselves according to

the forty-two Laws of Maat {M3<t 'Truth'},

{"42 Confessions of Innocence" (MGPML, pp. 225-33)}

which guide our moral and spiritual compasses, and hone our intuitive natures."

MGPML = Heru; Heru; Kilimanjaro; Kilimanjaro; Aaneb : Maat : Guiding Principles of Moral Living. U of KMt Pr, Detroit, 2013.

p. 176 religion-reconstructionism having "the longest history as a group"

"Probably the largest sect of Reconstructionists

{Another demographically quite large religion-reconstructionist group is that of Sumerians, largely founded by Zechariah Sitchin -- but these, devotees of the flying saucers, keep quite aloof from nonbelievers, so that the authors of this book (who seem to enjoy continually contending with spiritually non-responsive atheists, and with others of defective theology) never to much as mention such dedicated devotees.}

is that of Norse/ Germanic Heathenry -- of which Asatru is the largest interior group --

have the longest history as a group

{Reconstructions of obsolete religions have been ongoing since high antiquity -- already in the Roman Republic (in the the Roman Empire) there were attempts to revitalize Etruscan religion; and in the Hellenistic period (and thereafter) attempts to restore the Pythagorean Order; etc. etc. onward to the praesent day -- and plenty of aequivalent movements throughout history in Bharata and in Han.}

in several countries, including Iceland".

p. 177 "conservative" heathens

"a greater number of converts to U.S.-based Heathenry come originally from conservative Christian as opposed to liberal humanistic backgrounds,

{This would be adequate reason for entirely ignoring them.}

and bring some of their assumptions about scripture with them" ("PEMH").

"PEMH" = Gallina Krasskova : "Problem of Ergi in Modern Heathenry". In :- Essays in Modern Heathenry, II. Hubbardston (MA) : Asphodel Pr, 2012. pp. 60-1.

pp. 178-9 Reconstructionist-derived traditions; Reconstructionist eclectism

p. 178

"in "Recon-derived" traditions, it is considered acceptable to use divine inspiration as a primary source ... in lore."

p. 179

In ""eclectic" Reconstructionist derived traditions, ... rather than concentrating on re-creating one particular religious era, a group may work with several of them and rotate "cultures" among their rituals.

This eclectism of practice reflects an eclectism of theology : unlike many Recon groups that practice theological separatism ..., Recon-derived groups consider it acceptable to deal with the gods of many (or any) pantheons."

{The various pantheons may, or do, belong to the various planes-of-existence and to their subplanes. Connections (or communications) among such planes-of-existence and subplanes-of-existence may be somewhat tenuous, and may be largely dependent on the material plane-of-existence as an intermediary interconnection.}

p. 181 quoted from Hrafn, U.S. Heathen

"Germanic Neo-Pagans differentiate themselves from the Germanic Mesopagans (e.g., Asatru) by having increased reliance on U[nverified] P[ersonal] G[nosis]. ...

If someone starts talking about "Thor the Moon Goddess," ... this is ahistorical. ... .

{Yea. Whoever was talking about that may have confounded TO`rr with THOth (who is however a god). There are persons who think any pun clever.}

... I've been fairly critical of the core shamanism concept that most entities are benign,

{Any deity encountred by Michael Harner or his associates (who are themselves pleasant and well-educated) would surely be benign -- but Deities encountred by unpleasant and uneducated persons would not be so well-behaved on account of deities' general intent to rebuke both unpleasantness and neglect of erudition.}

but I've also had personal misgivings about ... Deities and spirits ... that we ... give in to their every demand as a way to placate them".

{Persons of good will and well-rounded education will encountre only Deities who are so benevolent that any suggestion by such deities ought to be followed by them -- but persons of ill will or lack of education are likely to encountre deities whose sarcastic remarks it would be folly to consent directly to; to obey literally would not placate the deities at all, but simply result in more sarcasm from those deities.}

p. 184 "messages from God" misdirecting efforts to ineffective actions in social activism

"A liberal Christian friend ... related that his branch of Christianity has basically decided that God no longer speaks directly to human beings. This decision was made out of ... the largest part of their modern experience of people who ... have messages from God in Christianity

tended to be ... types who bombed clinics because "God told them to.""

{The main pragmatic reason for disapproving the bombing of abortion slaughterhouses ("clinics") is that physical bombing is ineffective at actually hindring such slaughter, while endangering the bomber. Conjuring devils to do the hindring (perhaps by "mind-bombing") would be more effective, and less dangerous.}

p. 185 instance of an attempt to base a rite on a written symbol

[quoted from Jord[-]svin, U.S. Heathen] "[A new woman-membre] in a kindred ... told us ... that Tyr told her to carry a big spear around to ward the blots from now on."

{This was based on Ty`-r's rune's having the graphic appearance of a spear. The rune's graphic shape, however, is apparently irrelevant to the Norse god, for the runes' shapes generally derive from the Etruscan alphabet, which is artistically modified from northwest S^emitic alphabets.}

p. 187 instance of over-extending allegation of historic knowledge of estoric lore

"[A yogini (instructrix in yoga)] When asked whether the shamans of Native people traditionally work with chakras, she replied, "Well, shamans know their bodies well, and chakras are real, so yes, they must work with chakras.""

{Firstly, there is an exaggeration as to the scope of the cakra-s themselves : they are structures evident in the causal body, but not ordinarily in the mental body nor in the astral body, let alone in the material body. Secondly, the causal body is so very subtle that the esoteric knowledge of it is confined to only the most avidly arcane of occult systems (which seem to be reported only from the highly literate cultures of Bharata and of Han).}


Historical Praecedents


p. 190 Mormonism

"While a few denominations [of "Christianity"!] (notably the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) have put forth other scriptures, they have been loudly condemned for their presumption by the majority of Christians."

{Because the Utah Latter Day Saints use as illustrations to their currently-published edition of their peculiar Scripture, scenes based on MesoAmerican AmerIndian cultures (and explain in their literature that they regard the scenario of their scriptures as centred in the Tehuantepec isthmos), they cannot be regarded as Christian -- indeed, it would seem to be a semi-secret doctrine among them that they worship Quetzal-coatl instead of Iesous Khristos.}

p. 191 Deities control the evolution of human culture

"What if our cultures regularly attract the attention of new Gods

{If so, such "new Gods" may arrive from hitherto-uncontacted existential subplanes, and from distal galaxy-groupings. (This is a doctrine being ardently promulgated by flying-saucer contactees.)}

who provide us with the tools and ideas necessary to enter the next stage of development?

Instead of taking it ... that we mold our Gods based on our needs, suppose they mold us based on theirs?"

{The absolute refusal of the authors (and their associates) so much as even to acknowledge the existence of flying-saucer contactee religions is the cause of their inability to find natural allies in organizations which have long since been in regular ongoing communication with the veritable "new Gods" who are overtly and conspicuously functioning to "provide us with the tools and ideas necessary to enter the next stage of development". (Such "next stage of development" is, of course, [as proclaimed by flying-saucer contactee religions everwhere] universal communism maintained and upheld through universal telepathy.)}

p. 192 alleged "hunter-gatherers" as supposed builders of megalithic monuments

"For a long time it was thought a given that hunter-gatherers lived in small, simple ... societies. But twelve-thousand-year-old megaliths at Go:bekli Tepe in southeastern Turkey give the lie to that assumption."

{This dating must be at least two millennia too early (perhaps deliberately made so at the requaest of the local government of the province in Tu:rkiyeh involved, in exchange for permission to dig there), and is in need of eventual correction. The builders of these, and of all other megalithic monuments, must have been entirely agrarian farmers.}

p. 198 why was Sokrates put to death?

"The famous execution of the Athenian philosopher Socrates on a charge of "impiety" was largely trumped up to get rid of a popular political gadfly."

{How so? Though religiously popular, Sokrates was no politician; he had no political nor oikonomic nor social programme. But it is recorded that he often heard the voice of a "daimon" speaking to him; and certain religiously reactionary hypocrites maliciously charged him with the "impiety" of following the advice of the voice of a spirit not officially sanctioned by official state-cult. Political dissent the Athenians tolerated; religious hairesy they did not tolerate.} {If any "gadly"-like effect had been in evidence, his biographers would have mentioned this (and likely cited in this context heroine Ioi and her supernatural gadly), but they did not.}

{For his continual "hearing voices (of daimones)" and telling his audiences about such, Sokrates would now-a-days (in the United States or in western Europe) be arrested and locked into a solitary cell in an "insane asylum", where he would be secretly tortured-to-death by "psychiatrists'" adminstring that agonizing-death pill, cyanide.}

p. 200 the Good Shepherd

"Christians identified Jesus as the "Good Shepherd," and

{The phrase "Good Shepherd" (/Poimen Agathos/) had for centuries been applied to god Hermes, before it was basely plagiarized in the Euangelion.}

bishops in many denominations still carry a shepherd's crook".

{The Catholic bishop's staff, the lituus (having a vertical spiral as upper end), is unrelated to any paraphernalia of shepherds', and is plagiarized straight out of antique Roman (really, Etruscan) religion, as a diviners' instrument.}

p. 200 evil & good, both in the name of Christianity

"While there has been a great deal of evil done in the names of Christ

{The evil hath been done (such as, during the "Crusades") by war-mongering Catholic religious orders (especially the Dominican) and their militaristic political-state allies, and

and Allah,

largely by Sunni-s;

we should not forget that many good deeds have been done as well."

whereas the good hath been done by pacifist Catholic religious orders (such as Franciscan and Jesuit) and their political allies, and

(amongst Muslim-s) by Yarsani-s.}

pp. 201-2 why were Catholic saints put to death by Catholic ecclesiasts?

p. 201

"Joan of Arc ... spoke with voices while standing under the trees in a wood formerly sacred to Pagans".

{Official English trial-court records shew that Joan of Arc was (like Sokrates) put to death on account of her hearing a praeternatural voice, (in her case) "the voice of St. Catherine and of St. Margaret." ("JAV") The English government did not condemn her for her admitted worship of fae:ries [to which the English had no objection -- for, plenty of British folk did, and as yet still do, the same].}

p. 202

"prophet{esse}s such as Marguerite Porete, Prous Boneta, Gugliema of Milan, and Jeanne-Marie de Maille preached ... their divine visions ... . The first three were burned; de Maille was protected by Franciscans and thus ... like Joan [of Arc] she was canonized" ("JA&FM").

"SJAV" = "Saint Joan of Arc, Virgin—1412-1431" (quoting her confession at her court-trial) {It was, and as yet still is, of course, routine in France and in England to punish severely any commoner who hath (by alleging receiving acknowledgement from Heaven) usurped the ruling-class's authority.}

"JA&FM" = Anne Llewellyn Barstow : "Joan of Arc and Female Mysticism". J OF FEMINIST STUDIES IN RELIGION, 1, no. 2 (autumn 1985):33-6.

p. 203 how, by citing Simplicius, Galileo offended the reigning pope

"His old friend Maffeo Barbarini (Pope Urban VIII) offered some commentary ... defending Galileo ... . Galileo reproduced the pope's arguments in his 1632 Dialogue Concerning the Two Chief Systems of the World -- but put them in the mouth of a ... "Simplicio."

{Pope St. SIMPLICIus (d. 483) dedicated ("PSS") a church to St. Stephen; St. Stephen's vision (Acts of the Apostles 7:56) of "God" in Heaven may have offended Urban VIII, who may have subscribed instead to the dictum "No man hath seen God at any time" (1st Epistole of Ioannes 4:14).} {SIMPLICIus of Cilicia wrote a commentary on ("BS") Epiktetos. Epiktetos wrote ("SEPh:E4.3") in praise of prohairesis, which may have seemed praise of hairesis (heresy) to Urban VIII.}

After Galileo lost support {on account of this "Simplicio"} of his most powerful patron [Urbanus VIII], ... the Vatican were finally able to bring him to trial on hesesy charges."

"PSS" = "Pope St. Simplicius" http//

1st Epistole of Ioannes 4:14

"BS" = "Biography of Simplicius"

"SEPh:E4.3" = entry "Epictetus", section 4.3 "Volition", in Stanford Enc. of Philosophy

pp. 204-5 Freemasonry & orientalism prevail during the Scientific Revolution

p. 204

Scientists "of the Scientific Revolution" and had faith in "the Great Architect of the Universe {of Masonry and of Freemasonry} who created the Universe and the natural laws that govern it."

"Scientifically inclined scholars of religion sought ... the Truth behind all

p. 205

religions. They looked to Egypt and India for evidence ... underlying every faith."

p. 207 Church of the SubGenius; Discordianism

"The SubGenius movement is an elaborate satire poking fun at ... fundamentalist cults."

"Discordians draw inspiration from surrealism ..., their "holy book," Principia Discordia, is subtitled How I Found Goddess and What I Did to Her When I Found Her ...."

{Like Robert M. Pirsig's (An Inquiry into Morals -- heroine Lila who was encountred in a tavern, goddess Eris (Discordia) is encountred "at the bar of my favourite goth club" (Book of Eris. ).}

p. 208 humor, satire, and irony in Neo-Paganism

[quoted from Principia Discordia :] "Sometimes I take humor seriously. Sometimes I take seriousness humorously.

Either way it is irrelevant."

{That which is irrelevant is whether or not the denunciation is employing humor (political satire/irony) or not. It is nevertheless relevant that the denunciation hath a justifiable basis.}

"many modern Neo-Pagans freely incorporate Gods and ideas from various pantheons and cultures. ... the Gods can be ... decorative items used to give the proceedings a suitably "spiritual" air.

A movement that honors snarky irony and feels authority is inherently bad is likely to have problems with any kind of spirituality based on reverence and worship."

{This may not always be true, especially if the political-state "authority" being denounced be that of weapons-manufacturing capitalist warmongers.} {There are (among, e.g., AmerIndians) deities of irony and of satire; and they expect instances of irony and of satire to be routinely cited in the worship of them.}

Malaclypse the Younger : The Principia Discordia.

Kenaz Filan & Raven Kaldera : Talking to the Spirits : personal gnosis in pagan religion. Destiny Bks, Rochester (VT), 2013.